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286
 
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Since when did living beyond ones means mean that people don't want something? If it is there, they will take it. A well-off person may find a wallet on the floor and hand it in, but I bet a less well-off person would be more likely to empty it first. I am not saying all less well-off people are 'at it' but it stands to reason that the temptation is higher.
Either way, it doesn't matter if people are downloading copyrighted material or not - ultimately. The record companies may as well make peace with it. P2P is not going to go away, and putting pressure on ISP's to throttle, will drive it to an encrypted, underground past time so it can go undetected. There will always be a way around it and the more you punish for it, the harder it will be to detect. When that happens, they won't be able to find the real crooks that are downloading everything under the sun, burning it to CD and DVD and flogging out of the back of a car or down the pub.
The more ruthless the media companies and ISP's get over stopping this, the more it will cost them in the long run. They are already getting bad press for targeting 'perceived' innocents for having Lime-wire on their PC and throttling what they see as 'illegal' P2P activity when in fact they have no idea if the user is doing anything illegal at all. I have no sympathy for the ISP's and Jason's comments on the ISP's being "overburdened" holds no water with me at all. Perhaps if their networks were 8mb as advertised, they would not be overburdened and if their claimed "unlimited" downloads were TRUE, then why would they care anyway? They have been at it for years and now they are moaning because people are trying to use what they have paid for.
All this makes people loath media companies and ISP's and that is bad for business. Ask Microsoft who have had the comfortable position of being a virtual monopoly for the last 15 years, but now seem to be losing business. Linux seems popular now doesn't it!?
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Pentium
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Since when did living beyond ones means mean that people don't want something? If it is there, they will take it. A well-off person may find a wallet on the floor and hand it in, but I bet a less well-off person would be more likely to empty it first. I am not saying all less well-off people are 'at it' but it stands to reason that the temptation is higher
Sorry I think you misunderstood: my point was that uf someone can't afford to buy the CD it doesnt mean they have a right to download it for free (or that they are in the right!).
The record companies may as well make peace with it. P2P is not going to go away, and putting pressure on ISP's to throttle, will drive it to an encrypted, underground past time so it can go undetected..
Why should they make peace? The problem here is not the record companies OR the p2p providers etc. It is the *evil* pricks who download copyrighted stuff thinking they have a right to break the law as they like.. sorry but that's the way it is. P2P is a really useful tool but unfortunately it i s tainted by the misuse so many people make of it.
I agree that all this stomping about is giving the companies a bad name: and IMO that is undeserved. They are trying their best to protect their rights and their material without any help or care from joe public! People are breaking the law - they are doing their best to catch them. In the meantime it means inconveniencing everyone else who uses P2P legitimately - which obviously gives them a bad name.
In fact a lot of the P2P providers actively converse with the RIAA in a non-hostile environment. The community is desperately trying to come up with ways to eradicate the blight but it's fairly impossible isn't it? (and in the face of SO many idiots it becomes harder still). In the face of no solution these companies are becoming more and more cross....
Talk to any legitimate P2P user (like myself) and they will moan about ISP's and the RIAA for years - but ask about copyright theft and then they will REALLY get venomous... Record companies try to destroy P2P services because their material is under threat - illegal copyright thieves ARE destroying the services by misusing them..
Cheers,
Tom
My Crime is that of curiosity, my crime is that of outsmarting you
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286
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To brand a handful of people that download music etc on Limewire Evil Pricks is downright childish and I have never heard such crap in all my life. You astound me with your ignorance. Do you work for the RIAA? It sounds like you have some affiliation somewhere? I could name 1 or 2 evil pricks, but someone that downloads music off Limewire, although not going about things legally, are not evil pricks! Are Viacom evil pricks for promoting the use of Youtube? Are Youtube and Google themselves Evil Pricks?
Pathetic mate...I sit with my jaw on the floor. How old are you, 10?
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Pentium
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Mitch (31/07/2008)
To brand a handful of people that download music etc on Limewire Evil Pricks is downright childish and I have never heard such crap in all my life. You astound me with your ignorance. Do you work for the RIAA? It sounds like you have some affiliation somewhere? I could name 1 or 2 evil pricks, but someone that downloads music off Limewire, although not going about things legally, are not evil pricks! Are Viacom evil pricks for promoting the use of Youtube? Are Youtube and Google themselves Evil Pricks?
Pathetic mate...I sit with my jaw on the floor. How old are you, 10?
OK yeh.. strong choice of words, regretted it as soon as I clicked post.
I dont think it is childish at all though to blame people.... They are definitely pricks, perhaps not evil. These idiots are blithely doing this without a thought for anyone but them: me, you, the record companies, musicians etc. all lose out.
Using P2P legally becomes really tough and there is the constant worry that you'll get into hot water over legal content. All their fault.
I would dispute it is a handful of people: there are far too many.... 
BTW not affiliated with the RIAA or record companies etc. - I do however think that they have a right to defend their intellectual property if I dont condone the exact actions they take all the time. In fact I would disagree with a lot of the underhand methods used, even if I see *why* they are doing it (and would argue that they become as bad as those they are fighting).
Did you read the rest of the post around those 2 words? I think I made salient points there 
I dont see how this can be considered any different than walking into a shop and making off with a CD (or other merchandise).
Cheers,
Tom
My Crime is that of curiosity, my crime is that of outsmarting you
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286
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I understand where you are coming from on this and I too do not condone it. However I disagree that it is like stealing a CD from a store. A CD has a tangible value, it has been manufactured and distributed, that takes a vast amount of labour and theft of such items lead to insurance claims, which in turn will end up hurting us all. That is why I maintain that driving P2P underground will stop them from catching the biggest culprits, i.e. the shifty gits that make a living selling poor quality copies of whole albums or films. They should be the ones they concentrate on as these people are known to use the money to fund other crime and terrorism. Someone having a couple of dozen songs off Limewire isn't intentionaly profiteering and I maintain that the same way I used to tape my favourite songs off the radio, people will eventually go and buy the material or watch the band in the long run.
The RIAA banging on factory doors and demanding money to listen to the radio, as happened the other day to the factory my father is the MD of, will drive a wedge between them and the public. My father argued this point and they recommended the 200 strong workforce in a huge quarter mile long paper factory with spinning machines and many many fork trucks, all wear iPods, honestly, they couldn't see the health and safety implications. My father has now had no choice but to ban radio's completely...pathetic eh? Now this is going to turn people against the media companies, that there is little doubt of. Even my father was furious and refused to pay it. His words were "if they think I am paying £2000 per year to keep Robbie Williams in new Jags, they are on acid. How dare they hold hard working, working class people to ransom, well I am not paying it and I will ban radio's" of course this was met with fury from the shop floor but they supported the reasons why he did it. I can imagine all 200 of them getting home and firing up Limewire before their coats had even hit the sofa. So forgive me if I am a little Citizen Smith, but I think they have themselves to blame for it and I honestly think it is a storm in a teacup anyway.
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Lappy
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& a Nokia E61 for sofa surfing!
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